POSSIBLY Exploration: Maps, sailing, and progression

[NoNoNumGum 55]

A few days ago I played Ylands once again just to see how it is now. I was also looking through old screenshots of the game and one thing stuck out to me that I miss dearly.

 

I was playing with a friend a few years ago and I decided to go sailing without a map. I took off from the island and was staring at my screen trying to find birds that would signal land. I saw birds and went towards them to find a not so peaceful desert island. I then tried to sail back to the spawn island but found my self lost at sea. I had to keep sailing in one direction till I saw more birds and find land. Once I finally found land, it still wasn't the spawn island, so I ended up progressing on another island and making a map to eventually find my way home to that spawn island. It was an amazing adventure. (I tried killing my character but you would respawn on the closest island, idk if its still like this or not)

 

MAPS AND SAILING:

This story brings me to my main point/suggestions: This type of adventure will never happen again since you can now just press M to pull up a map you spawn with. You can also see islands next to you. This causes sailing to feel bland and just like walking. You no longer have to venture out to sea and into the unknown since you constantly know where you are. 

 

PROGRESSION: 

Now, I have been playing since 2017 so I know this game inside and out. But that doesn't mean I should be able to beat the game in 2 days. I've played Minecraft for years and it still takes months to get consistent ores and materials. The progression in Ylands is too quick. All you do is go to two islands and you can beat the game pretty much. You also come to learn what biomes are what levels and what levels have what ores. So for the "normal" exploration mode you just have to go to the edge of the map and then teleport to the biome you want depending on what ores you want.

I have suggested these things over and over, but I haven't lost faith in you guys. This game used to be a blast but I feel you guys have made it way too easy. I understand that its mostly a building game, but so is Minecraft yet it still presents a challenge.

 

Here are some ways I feel you could implement my suggestions:
 

Maps: Simply just re-add the need to make maps instead of having one on you by default.

Sailing: I understand that the few distance was increased and that is why islands are visible that are next to you. I don't know how it works or anything but decreasing the view distance and making it so you have to search for birds to find islands would be amazing.

Progression: I feel that if you simply removed the indicators that point out what level islands are, the game would be so much more fun instantly. To my understanding, certain ores only spawn on certain level islands.  If I land on an island and know what level the island is instantly, then I just have to search a little and find the ores that are specific to that level of island. But if it didn't have a level indicator, then I would have to search the entire island hoping that its the level I need. That instantly adds more time to play and explore.  The AI for most monsters is really easy to best in combat, simply by standing a rock and shooting it. So there is little to no challenge getting what you need to progress. This makes progression super fast and you don't get to soak in all the fun features the game has. 

 

I hope you take my suggestions into consideration. Thanks for reading and have a good day.

 

tl;dr: Add maps back, possibly make the sailing experience better, and try to slow down the progression in the game.

Edited January 25, 2022 by NoNoNumGum

[BinarySemaphore 31]

I mostly agree with these thoughts.

However, I feel a compromise for new players and those seeking more progression challenge is possible.

I do think having a map at spawn is a bit too easy, but having a hidden progression path to obtaining a map and requiring the player to keep it on them/in their hot bar is a bit burdensome and unnecessary (think - they have know and then google how to create a map and create it - what's the point other than cost time and some resources - not something really earned just a time sink).  Perhaps we could keep the map at spawn, islands stay perfectly mapped, but sea traversal is more fuzzy (like poor GPS signal resulting in "you covered somewhere along this 100 meter area but not a pinpoint position).  This would let you keep a island to island directional relationship and what shipwrecks (in an area of sea) you've explored.  Perhaps the player could create a ship compass/sextant which upgrades the map to give exact sea coordinates (not something you carry - just another object to add to the ship like helm/anchor).

I completely agree, with the island level being revealed too early.  Sometimes I have to stop myself from checking the map at first landfall, so I can enjoy exploring an island instead of just running off because it's low level.

I also agree with lowering visibility to hide islands further away on large maps.  Completely clear days with end-to-end map visibility should be 1 in 100 days chance.  Not suggesting poor weather, just the addition of a rare extra clear day that lets you see islands across the maps, so the majority of the time sailing is the only way to ensure there's no hidden land somewhere.  Right now it does seem too easy to just go island to island.

 

Additionally, I'd like to add the following:

When sailing to the edge of the map and going to a harsher biomes or if a seed gives higher level or large/unique islands, maybe add an event which puts the player(s) and their ship in a transitional all water map (no islands just a temporary challenge map).

The player must sail across the water world to "complete" their journey to the next map.

Chances for storms (rain or snow) could be higher, so just calm seas for the voyage are relatively rare.  However, there could be an increase in shipwrecks/underwater discoveries (especially since more underwater biomes and discoveries are in a planned future release).

The voyage can abandoned at any time to allow players to return to their previous map (say they run out of power and don't have a backup sail).  The map would be long left to right and player must sail left to right to complete the trip.  If they can't stay the course and end up too north or south, then the voyage is failed.  Incentivizing larger ships and that upgraded navigation for sea travel mentioned earlier.

 

That's my two cents, at least.  I know it's a lot to add, but hopefully we can see more sea travel challenges without making the game harder to get into.

Cheers and thanks for bringing this up @NoNoNumGum 😁

[spiritchaser28 920]

10 hours ago, BinarySemaphore said:

When sailing to the edge of the map and going to a harsher biomes or if a seed gives higher level or large/unique islands, maybe add an event which puts the player(s) and their ship in a transitional all water map (no islands just a temporary challenge map).

Ales has mentioned a few times on livestreams that he would like to implement occasional random encounters when traversing between maps. With unique challenges that would integrate into the game. So basically they are working on this plan.

[NoNoNumGum 55]

12 hours ago, BinarySemaphore said:

I do think having a map at spawn is a bit too easy, but having a hidden progression path to obtaining a map and requiring the player to keep it on them/in their hot bar is a bit burdensome and unnecessary (think - they have know and then google how to create a map and create it - what's the point other than cost time and some resources - not something really earned just a time sink). 

To be fair, this is the way it used to be and everyone got by fine. Maybe the player does want to look up how to get a map, then that's completely fine. But if a player wants to figure it out on their own, then they can do that too. 

 

12 hours ago, BinarySemaphore said:

When sailing to the edge of the map and going to a harsher biomes or if a seed gives higher level or large/unique islands, maybe add an event which puts the player(s) and their ship in a transitional all water map (no islands just a temporary challenge map).

The player must sail across the water world to "complete" their journey to the next map.

Chances for storms (rain or snow) could be higher, so just calm seas for the voyage are relatively rare.  However, there could be an increase in shipwrecks/underwater discoveries (especially since more underwater biomes and discoveries are in a planned future release).

The voyage can abandoned at any time to allow players to return to their previous map (say they run out of power and don't have a backup sail).  The map would be long left to right and player must sail left to right to complete the trip.  If they can't stay the course and end up too north or south, then the voyage is failed.  Incentivizing larger ships and that upgraded navigation for sea travel mentioned earlier.

I think this would be a great addition. 

2 hours ago, spiritchaser28 said:

Ales has mentioned a few times on livestreams that he would like to implement occasional random encounters when traversing between maps. With unique challenges that would integrate into the game. So basically they are working on this plan.

If I remember correctly, didn't they mention adding pirate attacks/random encounters?

[Dreed84 4]

Hi everybody,

is there a possibility to hide the mark on the map, where the one island is? Also, can I hide the small triangles showing the direction to the islands? It is too easy. I really enjoyed the adventure of sailing on the open see, not knowing where I am please bring this back by adding options to hide this things for more experienced players. 

Thank You

[spiritchaser28 920]

9 hours ago, NoNoNumGum said:

If I remember correctly, didn't they mention adding pirate attacks/random encounters?

The idea has been tossed around. I think they are waiting to do this when they are certain that it works seamlessly. Sort of like the idea of flying machines....they won't introduce those sort of things until they have airborne dangers to keep the game balanced.

[NoNoNumGum 55]

1 hour ago, spiritchaser28 said:

The idea has been tossed around. I think they are waiting to do this when they are certain that it works seamlessly. Sort of like the idea of flying machines....they won't introduce those sort of things until they have airborne dangers to keep the game balanced.

Ah I see. We'll see what happens.

[Nikki Severin 1148]

Hey guys! 

Very interesting thread you got here! I read through it all and also forwarded it to Aleš to read cuz we definitely appreciate your input  

[BinarySemaphore 31]

23 hours ago, NoNoNumGum said:

To be fair, this is the way it used to be and everyone got by fine. Maybe the player does want to look up how to get a map, then that's completely fine. But if a player wants to figure it out on their own, then they can do that too. 

True, and now they have the tutorial built in.

If maps come back, the player could pick up a existing map for the starter island.  The tutorial could also give a note mentioning, "I was able to make paper and a pencil, now I can map out where I've been" to hint at the recipe progression required to build their own map.

[NoNoNumGum 55]

Another thought I had is: 

I personally liked when we had to hold out maps and pull them up every time we wanted to use them since I would hold out my map and tell my friend which direction we needed to go. But incase some people might think it is tedious, I think a good system would be: You have to craft a map and then you can press M to open it, but if you lose it then you can't press M to open it anymore (since you don't have it).

[Dreed84 4]

On 1/25/2022 at 12:37 AM, NoNoNumGum said:

MAPS AND SAILING:

This story brings me to my main point/suggestions: This type of adventure will never happen again since you can now just press M to pull up a map you spawn with. You can also see islands next to you. This causes sailing to feel bland and just like walking. You no longer have to venture out to sea and into the unknown since you constantly know where you are. 

I can't agree more. It would be great if the islands were fare away as before, so you cannot see them. Also the little triangle on navigation cross should be optional. I understand, that someone want to spend more time on islands and venture from one to other as quick as possible. But for me and my friend the greatest fun was sailing on open see in the  storm not knowing where we are. The Yslands world is great, the weather, the environment, physic behavior everything is really great, but we really miss the sailing into unknown

I have a suggestion how to solve the island distance problem. The option to set a number of island for a map. If the size of the map would stay the same and there were just like 0-2 islands, there would be much more sailing for ppl who love it. 

Edited January 26, 2022 by Dreed84

[spiritchaser28 920]

I personally like the idea of crafting the map to use it. I also like the idea of the option to hide the tier levels and other things. I know they are working on the option to be able to see your friends on the map which is a pretty awesome option for some people (others really like being lost, but I think it's a nice option for other players especially since it has been a requested option for a few years).....what I really want to see with the maps is the ability to zoom completely out. I'd love to be able to screenshot a full map picture and it sort of helps seeing the bigger picture. ....I think the main idea of this entire post though is to allow the players the freedom to choose the options so we can all play how we like to play. So basically have a few options in the menu as to how we can view the map, or even the option to have no map like we have in editor now.

Edited January 27, 2022 by spiritchaser28

[NoNoNumGum 55]

14 hours ago, spiritchaser28 said:

.I think the main idea of this entire post though is to allow the players the freedom to choose the options so we can all play how we like to play. So basically have a few options in the menu as to how we can view the map, or even the option to have no map like we have in editor now.

Yes exactly. I believe the developers are really trying to do what everyone wants, but not everyone plays the same. We need more optional things like: The island indicators, friend indicators, island level indicators, etc.

And a system to choose if you wanna have to craft and use a map or just press M would be absolutely amazing.

 

Thank you all for adding on to my suggestions 😁

[arkaeldren 17]

I'm going to way Necro this thread as its something I need to comment on regardless of how old it is.  Why start a new thread when this says what I want already.  I am just now finding out about the changes in maps and the ability to see the Ylands and how far apart they are from one another.  No....  no and NO.  I was looking into this today,  as I wanted to get back into playing again after last playing in 2019-2020.  I loved not having a map.  I loved needing to hold it and the complications involved in not knowing where I was.  I liked not being able to see land and hope that I was going in the right direction and or how to find that "Right" direction.  From what I have seen and read, you guys dumbed it down and that was one of the things that this game had going for it.  Bring it back.  Don't think about it, put up a poll and lets have the community decide.  I cant believe you guys made it this way,.  Its not like you have a huge amount of players you can just abandoned with features that are attempting to cast wider and wider nets to sell this game to EVERYONE.  To sail for a full night and day and still not find land was what made this game awesome.  In fact I was waiting for these features to progress and fully expected it to.  Storms that would and could sink smaller vessels.  I am going to play the game later today.  I am going to come back and put in my 2 cents after I have played for 8-10 hours.  Here is some thing you have never heard before, Listen to your community.  Maybe you should listen to the people that are willing to buy and play your game.  But like every other time I have seen this take place, the creators and the teams ALWAYS think they know what's best.   Put up a detailed poll with these things that have been discussed.  

1) Give the player the ability to select the distance between islands be farther than you can see.  Like 80% of the islands a full in game day and night to sail to.

2) Revert the map system back to the way it was.

3) Give the option to turn off all of the EASY SETTINGS.  I still cant believe you cant turn off the HUD and Map markers.  Like why need a compass.  Well, if you don't have a map, the only way to find an island is to be able to head in one direction for a very long time.  HENCE the need for a compass.  That makes an item USEFULL.  Stop eliminating the need for certain items.  Instead create more needs for an existing item. 

4) Storms that are so bad it can disable your ship to an extent you need to wait for clear weather and head out in a Dingy.  Gives another reason to have one.  Bring supplies to rebuild incase of damage.  Make it to where these storms only occur in-between the most high level Ylands.  YEP, its not going to happen.  Why?  Because it would be to cool for a game like Ylands.

So far its very disappointing to be a returning player only to find you have made the game more accessible for 8 year olds by removing the difficulty from the people that actually have Money to pay for the game.  You know, us adults that enjoyed the game and some of its aspects that made it a small challenge.  You took away the CHALLENEGE of the game for anyone 10 and older.   WTF