DEV ANSWER [YLD-10459] Editor destroying explore worlds

[TheSparkPlug 128]

Firstly, a complaint!   We were assured by Ales that we could continue to edit explore worlds while the game remained in early access (and so still contained many bugs requiring the editor to fix).  I turns out that this is NOT the case.  [it may be still the case - see next post]

Now, here is the CRITICAL issue: any attempt to edit an explore world results in a NEW WORLD using the same seed. Moreover, when one discovers this so exits WITHOUT SAVING, the existing world is still replaced with the empty one. Fortunately I had a backup... or that would have been just under 500 hours of building one world WIPED.

I have seen quite a few posts from angry people claiming their worlds had gone - though, to be fair, none of them actually explained how/why. I suspect this may be the cause.

 

That needs to be fixed as a matter of urgency, but we also need the ability to edit existing worlds back... I regularly have to put all the sunken animals back on the surface, move my ship back into the water (it still moves on every load) and I know server owners need it for maintenance.

[V-Alfred 367]

Oh man.. I havn't tried to edit 0.9 explore mode, will comeback as soon as I got my result.

[TheSparkPlug 128]

Okay, an update to this...  It seems to be reverting my world not to an empty one, but to the world I started - as my ship is there (I pasted my ship into this world when I created it).

I have also noticed that in my "explore" menu, it says there are 5 games to search when there are only four. If I temporarily delete my main world it shows the correct number. So it looks like my main save is somehow two worlds in one. When I "explore" it opens up the world with all buildings etc in. When I "edit" it opens up the 'empty island plus ship' world. There is just a single save file. 

How can a single save contain two worlds?   More importantly, how can I fix that?

I've attached the save.  I hope someone can sort this

 

CC_THREE.zip

[Aleš Ulm 1725]

Hi, thanks for the feedback! As far as I know it should be still possible to edit your Explore saves in 0.9 - we'll look into the what you report right away!

 

[TheSparkPlug 128]

Well, during a sleepless night, I had a thought... is the editor somehow finding an old deleted copy of the world.

To test this I renamed the “SaveGames” folder, created a new one and copied my save into it.

The explore world still shows “search 2 games” when there is only one, but I was able to edit that world normally

 

As a background to this, “CC Three” was only meant to be a temporary name (I was testing to see if world name affected seed!). So, back in 0.6, I made a copy of the world and renamed it - hoping that renaming the file would rename the world. It didn’t. A short time later I deleted the original (now unused) save and renamed the new one back to its original name. This wasn’t an issue in 0.8, but as of 0.9, the editor is able to find a deleted save as long as there is an active save with the same name!?!?

 

Why the deleted save can be found by the editor is strange, but why it is used in preference to the active save is even stranger.

Of course, the biggest mystery is why can we not change the name of worlds 

 

 

Edited June 11, 2018 by TheSparkPlug

[Ane 1213]

Could you please also attach the logs of the world where you're having issues? Is "CC Three" the only save where this happened or does it happen consistently?

[TheSparkPlug 128]

It's only ever happened with that world.

As per the previous post, I have stopped it happening by creating a new savegame folder. Will the logs still be of use? If so, I will upload them.

[mid endian 37]

Is steam cloud the culprit? I ask this cause I made the mistake of using the save folder to host dedicated game. It wasn't just the old saves that steam cloud brought back, but all the log files too. Caused the game to crash after quitting. 

Turn off cloud save and try again. 

[TheSparkPlug 128]

I never use the cloud save.  

While trying to troubleshoot this issue i did turn it on and sync it with my current game. It made no difference, so I turned it back off again.

 

[Ane 1213]

15 hours ago, TheSparkPlug said:

It's only ever happened with that world.

As per the previous post, I have stopped it happening by creating a new savegame folder. Will the logs still be of use? If so, I will upload them.

Yes please do. Our testers weren't able to reproduce it, so any extra info is welcome.

[TheSparkPlug 128]

Logs attached - though I reiterate that I fixed the issue (see above).

 

I am fairly sure that the order of events that led to the issue were as follows:

1. Create GAME-A in the usual way

2. In windows file manager create a copy of it and rename it to, say, GAME-B

3. Play GAME-B (move, build, chop trees, whatever) so it now differs from GAME-A

4. Delete GAME-A

5. Rename GAME-B back to GAME-A

 

Now, the issue was this:

1. You could play normally without any problems

2. If you attempted to edit that world it resurrected the deleted game.

3. Even if you exited the editor without saving, the current world was replaced with the deleted one.

 

I solved it by creating a new SaveGame folder and copying my worlds to it, but why is it still saying "search 2 worlds" when there is only one?

output_log_clean.txt

output_log.txt

Edited June 12, 2018 by TheSparkPlug

[Ane 1213]

So apparently this is as designed, as you're not supposed to manipulate game files in file manager (one reason for this is that players would be able to make copies of decorations).

[TheSparkPlug 128]

:eek:

Anyone who plays any kind of world for any length of time is going to want to make backups of that world, and if necessary restore them.

Also, once enough time is invested into a world, they may want to make a copy to test something major before actually doing it in their 'live' world.

Decorations are just that... decorations. So what if someone duplicates them... it's not like they can pick them up or gain any kind of advantage from them, and anyone making a copy of their world is unlikely to keep playing both worlds.

Sorry, but anything built into a game which is designed to destroy worlds which players have invested many hours into is madness and badness - that really needs to be reconsidered as a matter of urgency!!!

[mid endian 37]

 

So basically, we're done being able to edit saves. 

[TheSparkPlug 128]

So, why is my world counted as two for the search box?   How do I fix that?

Is it connected to the fact that the old explore menu used to show a second instance of a world if it had been opened in the editor?

Also, out of curiosity, where is the list of explore worlds kept? (I notice from the logs that the game was expecting to find a couple worlds that had long since been deleted).

[TheSparkPlug 128]

On 15/06/2018 at 4:04 PM, Aleš Ulm said:

Please note that we’re always ready to fix any problems you may encounter, be it related to your game name, coyns, or anything else. Just let us know and we’ll take care of it.

[Houp 237]

You have basically 2 options now.

1) You can use file manager to copy save file to different folder (do not keep it in same folder as other saves). File name is not important for the game (not even extension. Changing it will not have any effect)

2) Use "Save as" button in ingame editor to make copy of your save. (no decorations in that copy) Now you will see in menu both original save and the copied one.

[Energritz_ 107]

On 13/06/2018 at 6:25 AM, mid endian said:

 

So basically, we're done being able to edit saves. 

So... for those of us that run servers how are we supposed to effectively manage our worlds now? unless you made a custom world... which i don't do because last time PB's weren't available for normal play when maps were made this way... this is not a great way to run a public server for peace of mind.

I don't use editor often but i use it to "clean" ( remove corpses and trash items, bugged trees and other plethora of things.. ) to try and keep the server performance the best it can be, because there is no mechanism still to effectively do this yet..

If this is no longer possible then whats the point of player run servers as they would be identical performance to official ones... other than private whitelisted servers and some with custom options for Pve/Pvp etc ...

I sincerely hope this gets changed so that at least admins that run servers can continue to do this until a system is in place where its not required and then this wouldn't be much of a problem.

[TheSparkPlug 128]

1 hour ago, Houp said:

1) You can use file manager to copy save file to different folder (do not keep it in same folder as other saves). File name is not important for the game (not even extension. Changing it will not have any effect)

Confused!

Apparently, it is doing just that which caused my issues in the first place... as advised by @Ane above "You're not supposed to manipulate games in file manager".

Also, how does either option stop my game thinking that one world is actually two?

Clearly the issue lies with the list of saves the game is expecting to see. That is why the logs show it looking for saves that were deleted using file manager, and probably why it thinks there are two instances of my single "cc three" world.

Normally games rely solely on the content of the savegames folder, or they maintain a LOCAL text file list of the saves that it thinks exists. Neither seems to be the case for Ylands. Where is that list kept?

[Houp 237]

1. Create GAME-A in the usual way

2. In windows file manager create a copy of it and rename it to, say, GAME-B

2B. Do not keep GAME-A in same folder as GAME-B -> move it to the your folder outside the game

3. Play GAME-B (move, build, chop trees, whatever) so it now differs from GAME-A

4. Delete GAME-A

5. Rename GAME-B back to GAME-A

This should work. If you do not want to keep GAME-B then just delete it and move GAME-A to save file folder.

[TheSparkPlug 128]

@Houp, thank you for that explanation, but that shows how I should have done it.

As I have already done it the wrong way, my the game now thinks my save is two worlds (I have three worlds showing but the screen says "search 4"). How do I fix that?

... and the mystery of where the active saves list is kept?

[Houp 237]

There is no such list. All save files from that folder are loaded. Each save file has stored unique ID inside. When game tries to load second game with the same ID (which happens if you just copy game in file manager) it will just ignore it. (I am now not sure if "first" wins or "the last one")

So just try to find your most recent file by keeping just one copy of the same save file in the save file folder. Not the recent one? Just try another one.

[TheSparkPlug 128]

@Houp, but the log file includes these...

[EX] [00:00:26.55] System.IO.FileNotFoundException: Could not find file "c:\program files (x86)\steam\userdata\272142252\298610\remote\SaveGames\YLANDS_TWO.ylandsgame".

...

[EX] [00:00:26.60] System.IO.FileNotFoundException: Could not find file "c:\program files (x86)\steam\userdata\272142252\298610\remote\SaveGames\NEWGAME1.ylandsgame".

 

Two games deleted (in file manager) long ago. Why does the log file show the game trying to load them. They do not exist.. so it must have got those save names from somewhere?

 

 

Edited June 21, 2018 by TheSparkPlug