respawn beacon?

[Aethelis 38]

hey,

after i spent a large chunk of yesterdays gameing time by rowing a raft to the yland i died on, i thought about the matter a bit.

 

my prime choice would be some sort of respawn beacon (i'm not too picky about its look, be it a bed or a dais or what ever).

the main reason is, that its important to get the ship back, without the need to build a new one. so something that can be placed on a medium and/or large ship would be nice.

this could be further explored by a construction for placement on land. something i can build in my base, or more importantly on a yland i'm exploring or to which i resettled.

it would be for more advanced characters i guess, but idealy craftable without yllandium or other rare stuff.

on my first yland the spawn was inhabited by a wild puma, and i so wished i could respawn im my camp, without running the gauntlet everytime

 

another thing would be either a small craft that is faster than the raft (and without pressing W the whole time), or something like advanced paddles for the existing two. just to get that other ship from a distant yland, without sacrificing a lot of advanced ressources, faster than a raft does.

 

cheers

 

 

[Aleš Ulm 1725]

Hi,

the point you made is certainly good, an interesting one. Let me elaborate a bit why we haven't put something like that in the game (yet) (I'll take this chance to say something more general about how we view game difficulty).

We strongly believe that making the game too easy with features like respawning close to where you died removes all the tension, the fear for your character's life. The fact that you know that dying is a real setback is, we think, what makes exploration of far islands much more interesting.

At the same time we understand that there's a very thin line between "challenging" and "frustrating" - especially since we are aware that due to game still being Early Alpha players can die from time to time in ways that can be seen as "unfair".

It's super easy to make something less difficult, to add something ... and usually really annoying (at least for players) to make something more difficult and remove features they grew used to.

Because of this we plan to watch carefully how bigger number of players play the game and we probably won't be making any changes like that before we a) have more data b) have eliminated the deaths caused by bugs or poor design as opposed to those caused by players' skills or decisions. Putting something like you asked in the game before that (even if it was something difficult to craft) would be a bit rushe

That being said - feedback like you just provided is still super important to us - we read it every single day and talk about in on regular basis  ( we've actually talked about something like "respawn beacon" couple of weeks ago  )

[Aethelis 38]

that makes sense, i'm actually fine with the difficulty and danger (and thrill) that exploration imposes.

 

the other point that plays a bit into the respawn beacon thing would be settling over to a new yland.

the possibility to select another yland as my new "hometurf" would be great. but i can see how this is a rather large backdoor for a mobile spawnpoint. maybe link it to a certain amount/type of crafting tables built on the yland.. 

i'd like to hear if theres any plans concerning this topic as well.

 

cheers

 

 

[Aleš Ulm 1725]

The idea of selecting another yland as your "home" is indeed something worth considering. As long as it always is a single place and setting it up it is not a simple task it does make sense. There are no specific plans concerning this right now but it is definitely something we need to look into.

[Aristodikos 13]

An adjustable respawn point is a must of the game!!!

 

As you explore the whole map, and the game is EA, there are a lot of chances to start again and again from the begining. 

 

A good idea for me is to be able to make a BED as a respawn point

[Jeania 6]

I definately agree with this... I had a large ship that I couldn't seem to find after my death. I made a small sailboat (not a raft) and I found 2 ice islands (yeah, not where I had my ship ^^) and then I literally searched for about 3 rl hours trying to even 'find' another island.. No birdies in the sky after the ice (maybe they froze? ^^ ran outta food) And eventually I had to start over. Highly frustrating.. I understand difficulty curves (I've been a gamer for years ^^) but we really could use both a moveable respawn selection.. whether bed, or selecting another island. And in another thread, someone mentioned a compass... I think that'd help tremendously as well.

Totally understand this is EA, and you guys have done a phenomenal job. Just really hoping this may be something to consider in the not too distant future ^^

Also, feed those damn birds ^^ Not just teaching them to swear

[Gracekain 86]

With multiplayer coming into the game, maybe setting up claim markers to label your yland "home" would create a spawn point.

 The claim markers could be some sort of statute or village marker that requires a lot of resources.  It could require a Chisel, some sort of hammer and either 500 stone, sandstone, or marble to create the village stone and plop it down.  When you plop it down it creates a stone in the color of the resources you used to create it.  It will also create a small ownership radius and prompt you to type in a name.  The name is then displayed and etched into the stone and when a player enters the area they are greeted with a console message that they are entering/leaving "town name"

 You can only have one town marker and you must destroy the first one to create a second one.

[Miguel Preguisa 443]

Great suggestion Gracekain! (It's something like in Medieval Engineers, isn't it? I watched a little of your loong video)

With something like this it would be really great time to add customizable flags.  But I'm not absolutely sure with the "ownership radius" and "town name". What if we, for example, hid our totem in a cave so nobody could find it and set traps around it (or loot items for our new start) so it wouldn't actually be in our home? Everybody would be getting the message about stepping on our property when actually just passing around some cave.

[Gracekain 86]

The radius was just an added suggestion, it provided no other function than to let people know that they are getting close to a town center/stone.  Getting rid of the radius is completely fine with me

[Aleš Ulm 1725]

Hey,

I just stopped by to say that we do read what you say and discuss it  :). Actually the respawning process is something we have been discussing for some time now and there will definitely be some changes implemented - don't let me saying this stop you from throwing in your ideas though - keep them coming. We're always looking for ways to improve the game!

[Gracekain 86]

How about, a one-time use auto "Ylandium Defibrillator".  If it is in your backpack it automatically detects when you die and starts a charging processes, once they ylandium diverts all its power to the defibrillator it then shocks you back to life.  Once used the energy fires the circuits and renders the object useless.  You can salvage some copper tubes and metal scraps out of it when you are done.  If you happen to carry more than one defibrillator, the amount of electrical power required to shock you back to life would also render the other defibrillators and possibly other electrical items on your person useless.

 

[Miguel Preguisa 443]

I just kind of don't feel like resurrection should be a thing in the game.  Even now it's nice enough to allow us picking up all the dropped items and leaving us our "memory" (not learning everything again, like it once used to be).

[Aethelis 38]

that would in most cases mean, that you are resurrected next to a hungry predator or a bloodthirsty goat.. not sure if i'd like that

 

instead of the pikarillator i would vote for some sort of a flag, that can be carried around, and when placed on a island, resets the spawn point to that island.. or the flag.  beaching a new island always has that great feeling about it, being able to ram your flag into the newfound soil is almost a must..

i'd be okay, if the ground has a requirement for the flag to be placeable. just a flat space or covered with some floorblocks (the later would make it easier to set a minimum space, e.g. 3x3 floorblocks), maybe even a specific kind of floorblock (the clay ones a quite easy to make, so maybe at least stone). also it should have a timer, until it can be picked up again.

as an added bonus, it could show up on the map, and it should be customisable (like one of the flags is part of the recipe so you can choose how it looks)

 

also, it would mean, that if you like to explore deepwater sites, you should place the flag on a nearby island first. and you should not die while your flag is in your inventory (mostly because i dont know what would happen then..)

it isnt very important for me, to be able to place such a spawnpoint on a ship (i'd like the option to make another island my home), but i see why others would like that a lot. so maybe it has to be a large ship to handle this spawn-flag? 

 

[h2stipandav 21]

I vote flag!

And I'd like to add some thoughts.
In my opinion (don't take it hart Aethelis ) ;

Flag should have 4 states: Set up, dropped, carried and held in a boats flagholder.

• Setting the flag resets the spawnpoint (placing a flagpole and pulling the flag up might be the setting task)
• Dropping the flag leaves it lying there without setting your spawnpoint (perhaps a timer in flag's annotation and even HUD, end of timer returns the flag to its last set place in dropped state)
• Carried by both hands on a small pole (restricting any other interaction, movement speed (, even torch) before dropping/setting/holder) [ver 2: backback slot]
• Holding it in a ships flagholder wouldn't set the spawn, but merely allow you to ship it further (Otherwise why take it off a ship at all?)

 

Spawn should set to the flag, not yland.. otherwise it could be at a really uncomfortable (random) place. (and you still couldn't choose to spawn at your chosen location for a base, but you'd have to build your base near the new spawn [If you wish to spawn at your base])

Maybe (some?) structures outside flags range should decay (or rather not). [pointless lag?]

Building a flagpole and pulling up the flag shouldn't be too hard, but rather pulling it down it (e.g. special one-use tool). I wouldn't want to create small (big?) floors here and there just to capture another yland (set another spawn location) and eventually I would get too used to bringing "9 blocks" (or a flagpole, haha) with it.

As the flag represents conquering, I'd like it to be the first thing possible to be built on any yland, even before any other creations (In case I intend to stay there longer).
When you have lowered your flag you might leave your flagpole there waiting for your (bit easier) return, or you could destroy it.

The flag could be a custom .jpg .png  (but that would probably need a flag whitelisting system for MP atleast )

One reason I'd prefer a flagpole over a claim marker is that it can be seen from far.
 

Edited May 8, 2017 by h2stipandav

[agathadaemonn 1]

Maybe you guys should add some marker on horizon showing which direction we die.

[Miguel Preguisa 443]

7 minutes ago, agathadaemonn said:

Maybe you guys should add some marker on horizon showing which direction we die.

It's about orientation in maps.  And when compass will come, it will be even easier.  

[Jeania 6]

Honestly I think this discussion should be pinned ^^ Some really really great ideas here.
I put in my 2 cents in on the topic.. but the recent world I started (after 3 hours of trying to find my boat, maybe more.. i gave up lol and started new) the island I found is..awesome. Like seriously awesome. And I've got myself built up bigtime. But not ready to sail anywhere, or go down deep in the ocean or caves because I don't want my character to die and not be able to find this boat. I'm honestly not complaining; I enjoy every world I play. But I'm hoping it does highlight the need for some sort of rez resolvement; when you don't want to play a world because you may not be able to find the spot where you died..it gets disheartening. Solution could be found in a lot of these amazing comments; I love them and look forward to continuing to read this thread.

Also, one thing I wanted to point out to the Devs is my appreciation for how you interact with us. You actually reading what we write or say; it makes a big difference. I like that, and want to thank you for it. You'd think that'd be standard; but sadly, not every game has a good team in regards to their gamers. So thanks.

 

edit: oh and Gracekain; that rocked @ the " pikarillator" (lol funny Aethelis) lol got a kick out of that.

 

Edited May 12, 2017 by Jeania
small comment

[Aleš Ulm 1725]

Speaking of respawning - you might want to check the latest Sneak peek we've just posted. Feel free to (actually, I encourage you to! ) keep this discussion alive, though. The upcoming solution is just meant to make the dying less annoying for you with a very simple (and probably temporary) change - in  order to implement something more sophisticated (quite possibly based on some of your ideas), something we will be sure would be good enough to stay in the game for a long time,  we will need more time so in the meantime ... keep 'em coming!  

[Jeania 6]

I'll def look into it later on tonight! So excited, thank you guys! <3

[Phoenixstar117 1]

I don't mean to beat a dead horse, as this is pretty old... also, I am yet to actually play the game so my opinion isn't very valid (waiting for Steam release. All I know about the game is Youtube plays, and I have come to the conclusion that 'no spawn points' is probably the thing that pisses them [Youtubers] off the most. One of them is always on a very fine line between rage quitting and just getting to that next island the entire time).

But my take is that there is a basic divide between hardcore experience players, and more casual players. And how to adapt to that is to simply add a basic "difficulty" setting, where you have at least two basic settings (possibly permanent or toggle-able) with one being "hardcore" and "casual." The hardcore is obviously for those seeking thrill and strive off that fear of death, while the casual is more for those just wanting to sandbox and explore. The hardcore would be as things currently are, no real way to set a spawn, and so on... the casual would allow a player to create a new spawn point, whether through crafting and placing something or by simply sleeping in a bed.
Perhaps, at some point in the game (some advanced technology level) you could set individual spawn points, one of which you could choose after dying (similar to how Ark: Survival Evolved allows you to spawn a new character at a bed owned by your tribe).

That's just my quick suggestion on this seemingly old conversation... that's personally just how I would like things to be. Regardless, I am still excited for the game's release and will likely be one of the people purchasing it day 1 on Steam

[Aleš Ulm 1725]

Hi,

thanks for the feedback (any is appreciated! :)). The truth is that while we are planning on expanding how the spawning works at this moment, in future we would also like to give players options to customize their games (Exploration included) experience much more which I think you will find interesting :).

[A3_Melle 150]

Hi @Aleš Ulm I have been looking at videos from some of the video game content creators on youtube the last few days (apperently there is a big hype under them with Ylands, and thank @Myrik Greene for all the tweets with links).

They really like the game but 1 thing they do talk about is the respawn after they die on a other Yland than where they started and need do the entire trip over again, they hate that, and that point is the biggest downside of the current version in their eyes. 

Even seen 1 video where they player did not want to risk big exploration just because he was to afraid to die on that Yland and start over again, and the fact that they injure them selfs (falling or by a animale attack) they still need to do a bit of exploring getting the tools to heal faster and i don't want to spoil that part as that should be on them to find that out on their own

[BigBoss87 68]

You're right Melle.
Yesterday I was watching an Ylands streaming. I gave a little help for progress to be faster and really the players love it when they realize how much they can do.
When you listen to players who played so many hours of other good survivals to say that they cant choose between Ylands and others is a great sign and I'm glad for that!

[Aleš Ulm 1725]

"talk about is the respawn after they die on a other Yland than where they started and need do the entire trip over again"

@A3_Melle Yes, we watch those as well  Just as I said - we have some future plans where the spawning scheme as it worked until now will make sense and will result in an interesting and fun gameplay but it needs some other features that are not in the game yet. At the same time we want for the players to have more controls over the game settings but it will, as well, come at a later date.

We had a discussion about this and as a result, we decided for the time being to let players spawn at the yland where they died because we don't want the new players to get the wrong picture. To be honest I think that under normal circumstances the "punishment" for dying should really be more strict than running 50 meters back to where you died to get everything back because it takes away some of the thrill - but these are not the usual circumstances. Players can still die many times without being really responsible or without any chance of avoiding that - be it because of the bugs or still rather unbalanced combat. Also the navigation has a lot to be desired (although in few days you'll get your hands on a provisional GUI compass when sailing ships ) and because you still don't get to see other ylands in the distance, it can get quite difficult to find your way around. Because all of this it makes sense that we now make it easier for the players. At the same time, we'll still be working on some changes and improvements for future and I hope to share those with you soon.

Thanks again for your feedback - it doesn't fall on deaf ears

[A3_Melle 150]

@Aleš Ulm #SpoilerAlert: Compass inbound

And I am a ARMA veteran so i know what you mean with "it should not be a 50 meter walk"

 

I of course have in the back of my head that a respawn beacon will be a thing in the future, it has been told several times, just those guys could make or break a good start of sales, the big + on that side is that they really love the game (and the idea behind it) and some are just screaming when they need to start running for animals or wenn they finally achieve a next level with unlocking somwthing they can craft and so far and this is still version 0.60 and we got a nice road ahead and they will do a video every now and than to check out the new updates

[arkaeldren 17]

I have been around playing games for a very very long time.  Was around for Bethesdas start, was around for Atari's start.  I'm old, and not that this alone would qualify me any more than anyone else.  I'm just trying to express to the Devs of Ylands that I have some experience and wisdom due to pure time watching games, developers and money men in the gaming industry.  I'm going to list a few more things in here than just what is related to the spawning issue so bare with me please.

1) I fully realize the importance to the Devs wanting death to feel like its got substance and a value. On this one you guys have very little choice but to implement a system such as,

        a) Some type of spawning pole which was detailed above

        b) Bed spawning but restricted to setting a specific bed as the only spawn point.  Could work in conjunction with a land marker, or a spawn pole/land marker claim combination so as to allow using/building other beds for the intended purpose.

        c) One choice for the gamer could be as soon as one makes a bigger ship that you could choose it to be your spawn, and that would eliminate the cheat usage of placing a bed just outside an expedition or cave diving run.  Cough cough ARK SURVIVAL.

A few opinions coming next.  I have been spot on with seeing great games and watching them explode, and Ylands has this opportunity even in this over saturated area/market of gaming. Your small team has managed to slightly separate itself from soooo many other Survival/Crafting games and it would be sad to see its wind die down because of a few critical errors.  I have been saying since about 1998 that one of the most devastating things game creators and or developers can do is 'Frustrate" the player in the attempt in trying to make something a challenge or increase in difficulty.  Please guys, don't make this mistake, if the response is just pissing people off, remove it and implement something that doesn't.  It is that simple.  Don't stop communicating with the community no matter how large it becomes.  As of the last 4 weeks I have seen 6-8 Youtubers playing Ylands with large sub counts and watch lists as I am sure you guys have been doing as well.  This "IS" going to translate into purchases just due to exposure, but trying to make it the best exposure possible would and should be common sense.  Should have fixed the spawning issues and a persistent map way before your main advertisers started flooding vids on Ytube.  I really believe Ylands has an opportunity to do at a smaller scale what Minecraft did, and like it or not, it is the holy grail of simplicity in graphics and tech, with incredible game play.  Ok I sound like im preaching, but one last thing.  If someone that has the final say on a feature, or an implementation of major changes cant be told, "No F-off man, its a bad idea, and this new one is better" then you have to many yes people, and this is why a lot of good ideas get missed, and bad ideas continue. Again, sorry for this, I am not trying to tell you guys how to do your game, im just relaying the issues I have seen through out the years.

1) Please allow a way to tie the small sail boat/dingy behind your ship

2) A few headers that explain what recent items you have unlocked for crafting, just in the form of buttons or tabs at the bottom of the menu system you can click on to see these newly unlocked items.  Maybe a visual tech tree of some kind?

3) Mapping is persistent, make a map, and its data is fully restored.  Not saying you spawn with a map.  Making your death show up on the map, or an icon directing you.........NO

4) Ships should absolutely have the hulls accessible with sleeping areas, storage pre-built walls if need be, but blank open hulls accessible through hatches is on the to do list I'm sure, but please make this happen as a priority sooner than later.

4) Now this could go on for a while, but I am sure most of this has come up in discovery meetings already.  But going to leave this because its true, follow Minecrafts evolution in the Ylands way but faster.  As soon as the sales start coming in from steam, go get the increase in staff and push for a flood of Tree Log colors, basically different species with there own textures after cutting them down,  breeding, cooking advanced exc exc.  You guys will be able to go to your Money men, (The Board) after Dec 6-10th with a strong argument to throw more assets at this. Strong strong Beginning game, Mid Game and Endgame. But I am positive this has come out in discovery.  You guys have a shot here, and it could be a good one.  I posted this because its great to hear it from the community not just in those meetings where everyone "thinks" they are on to something, you guys ARE onto something.

Oh BTW: Increase stack/storage sizes by a 25-40% margin in all containers and stack values.

Dren