Ylands is broken & something needs to be said

[RedEagle_P1. 905]

I have been a longtime defender and promoter of this game, whenever people brought up issues I always told them to be patient as this game is in early access. 

 

However, this game launches later this year and its in dire shape: 

1) For 2 years servers have needed to wipe progress weekly to work properly. 

2) Lag, building bugs, freezing, online play is on life support causing this game to burn 90% of players who come down to it. 

 

Moreover, messaging is really pushing people away as these issues are not addressed in Dev Diaries or anything. 

When you don't share your challenges alongside your victories it makes the community feel you don't have challenges, or don't know what is happening and the struggle the players are having. 

One example is the social features launched in the last update. We constantly get pings but no one is talking, we often can't access our clan list or friends list... most of it does not work and then your new update hypes up new features. It feels like an endless train of broken promises rather than a struggle for victory. 

 

Its really hard for me to talk like this as I am such a positive person... oof. 

 

I know what people think and say behind your back and your approach to things is discouraging people. Most of these people don't understand the challenge of building a game but good messaging can bring doubters on board. My suggestion: stop the cooperate smiles and just be real with people. Be real with your struggles, your challenges, your vision and ambition. People follow people, be real, be human. 

 

 

Edited August 23, 2019 by RedEagle_P1.

[zarwil 393]

0.15 should really just be an all out bug fixing update. No point adding loads of features if game-breaking bugs exist at release.

Edited August 24, 2019 by zarwil
what does "resolved" mean? xD

[Indomitus 388]

As difficult as it may be to talk about, I do agree with this.  Consider it a "we bring this up because we care" sort of discussion.  The game has incredible potential, but with the full release approaching rapidly, there are still some glaring imperfections.  If we're wanting to build a community around the game, the online multiplayer experience needs to be much more smooth and reliable.

[kimbuck 746]

I like the  game,  however after starting a  game  it  soon deteriorates with lag  and other  reported  issues  that make the  game  difficult to stay with, The result is eventually  you are in the  game as  a solo player, and  new players  do not stay with the game.

The  issue  is  the MP games / servers ...  players are  crying out for the restoration of the explore  games, but  as there  are  bugs  etc  which griefers  exploit,   a lot  simply   give up 

What you need  to do is  address all the MP  issues,   bring back  the   explore games ..but  clearly  labelled  as  pvp or pve  and set them  up accordingly,  and make it so those  with dedicated  non pvp servers do not have to  re  map their games so often

Also  allowing  more players  per game  ...say 10 ?   because often i arrive to find the  game  full and unable to get in ,  and  others  do  too, so  what happens  then is  in the less busy hours,  no one   bothers  to join in believing  they will not get in.

The episode of  no  feedback and  silence to  bug reports  also made a lot of players  drift away

Result :  new players  do not  stay.

So  please ,  listen to that red   seagull   ooops  eagle    .. as  crazy as he is, because    he  makes a lot of  sense and there are a lot of P1 gamers backing him, and who will be  keen to push  a  working  Ylands  game platform to the forefront   

Edited August 23, 2019 by kimbuck

[RedEagle_P1. 905]

@Adam Snellgrove you're doing a great job imo -- this really goes to whats been happening before you came on. Maybe asking BI if you can share challenges such as the ones I have heard about would be awesome. I don't share them as I don't know if they are meant to be private. 

[SweetPeaCC 16]

I really Love this game, and want to see it become a huge success. All those issues RedEagle pointed out are in the way of Ylands success.  

[RedEagle_P1. 905]

1 hour ago, SweetPeaCC said:

I really Love this game, and want to see it become a huge success. All those issues RedEagle pointed out are in the way of Ylands success.  

Well said  

[Adam Snellgrove 1451]

I do think, that bringing me on and letting me go at it with my kind of approach and with my kind of attitude is BI trying to address this communication issue, that you have all felt recently. But, and I can only talk on behalf of myself...well I can talk on behalf of Ylands normally, but in this instance...that I'll definitely try not to be corporate with you guys and I think, so far, I haven't been.

And concerning problems and issues that you mentioned, since I arrived, I have tried to address every bug and suggestion, though if I missed someone, I am sorry. And I also went a little bit back addressing some older issues. But I couldn't do the whole backlog, because a lot of these issues might have been resolved by then or otherwise solved, so if you have ANY persisting trouble or problems, PLEASE submit them again each separately into the suggestion or bug section with out_logs, screenshots and so on and so forth ? and I WILL address them (as I have all bugs since I came on). But if you do so, it will show us, what is still unresolved and what needs fixing. Now concerning struggles, one I can disclose right now is, that we are swamped with preparing update 0.14. because it is going to be a biggy, so it is very difficult addressing some of the bugs lately because the testers have their hands full with the update itself. But also some if not many of the issues experienced by some are planned to be addressed in 0.14, so it might be the case, that you'll report the issue and I'll get back to you, that it is being resolved just as we speak ?

I think, that this has mainly happened in the interim of Community Manager change, where there really wasn't anyone to hold down the fort, but now it is up to us to start the conversation going again ? So if you write out the issues still giving you grief throughout the weekend, I'll log them in on Monday and we'll see, what can be done ? And i hope, that through the Ynterviews, Dev Diaries, #SelfieSundays and #WackyWednesday you'll see us as the humans we are, and not as the lizardmen, that have been sent by their reptilian overlords to prepare Planet Earth for the glorious and inevitable cold-blooded uprising! ALL HAIL THE SLITHERING MASSES!!!...ehm. 

[RedEagle_P1. 905]

1 hour ago, Adam Snellgrove said:

I do think, that bringing me on and letting me go at it with my kind of approach and with my kind of attitude is BI trying to address this communication issue, that you have all felt recently. But, and I can only talk on behalf of myself...well I can talk on behalf of Ylands normally, but in this instance...that I'll definitely try not to be corporate with you guys and I think, so far, I haven't been.

And concerning problems and issues that you mentioned, since I arrived, I have tried to address every bug and suggestion, though if I missed someone, I am sorry. And I also went a little bit back addressing some older issues. But I couldn't do the whole backlog, because a lot of these issues might have been resolved by then or otherwise solved, so if you have ANY persisting trouble or problems, PLEASE submit them again each separately into the suggestion or bug section with out_logs, screenshots and so on and so forth ? and I WILL address them (as I have all bugs since I came on). But if you do so, it will show us, what is still unresolved and what needs fixing. Now concerning struggles, one I can disclose right now is, that we are swamped with preparing update 0.14. because it is going to be a biggy, so it is very difficult addressing some of the bugs lately because the testers have their hands full with the update itself. But also some if not many of the issues experienced by some are planned to be addressed in 0.14, so it might be the case, that you'll report the issue and I'll get back to you, that it is being resolved just as we speak ?

I think, that this has mainly happened in the interim of Community Manager change, where there really wasn't anyone to hold down the fort, but now it is up to us to start the conversation going again ? So if you write out the issues still giving you grief throughout the weekend, I'll log them in on Monday and we'll see, what can be done ? And i hope, that through the Ynterviews, Dev Diaries, #SelfieSundays and #WackyWednesday you'll see us as the humans we are, and not as the lizardmen, that have been sent by their reptilian overlords to prepare Planet Earth for the glorious and inevitable cold-blooded uprising! ALL HAIL THE SLITHERING MASSES!!!...ehm. 

1) For sure, the lack of a community manager has been an issue however, I also feel that sharing some struggles can really help get people on board. I know there has been some issues with Unity assets and contractors, idk what all I can say but (imo) feel free to be technical with us and let us know whats-what. This way we know those critical issues are not being ignored but addressed. Moreover, talking about substantial matters such as the games vision, target market etc. can really hit-home with a mature audience like Ylands has. The more we know about what you are doing and why, the more we want to be part  I know you are targeting the roblox niche and I know so much more about your plans that I can't really share -- sharing these would help encourage people. 

There are similar games out there like Worlds Adrift which recently shut down after failing to attract players. Many people are worried about such a scenario with Ylands. My biggest challenge with P1 Creators is people are unwilling to create if they believe the game does not have a glowing future in which people will see and appreciate their work. This is why I work so hard to get them funds -- its something tangible beyond a promise that shows BI is willing to take that risk together with the creators in the community. This news really picks things up. 

2) No response to bugs has been an issue and I see you going after each one! I appreciate it and i hear others do also  

3) I have issues submitting logs as finding them and then removing any file-paths that would expose my personal info such as name can be an issue. I usually submit from in-game but we don't know if those are just too many to be addressed. 

I will say ALL servers have this lag/reset/wipe issue and have for 2 years and it's the #1 thing doing damage atm. BI servers, Nitrado, local servers etc.  

 

All these issues totally pre-date your arrival by a long shot and you have done a bang-up job since you arrived. I think we are all rooting you on and wishing for the best. 

[RedEagle_P1. 905]

45 minutes ago, kimbuck said:

So  please ,  listen to that red   seagull   ooops  eagle    .. as  crazy as he is, because    he  makes a lot of  sense and there are a lot of P1 gamers backing him, and who will be  keen to push  a  working  Ylands  game platform to the forefront   

Ooof almost seagulled me there  

 

46 minutes ago, kimbuck said:

Also  allowing  more players  per game  ...say 10 ? 

I also think this is critical. A lot of people see the 8 player cap and judge this game and walk away and I think the 16 player cap for all servers would be amazing (once lag and bugs are fixed). 

[Adam Snellgrove 1451]

I do get the gist of it, but to make this constructive and so we get moving on these issues (which we all want to do), what would help me the most is, if you made a seperate topic on each of these in the bug or suggestion sections (as you see fit) and set out, what it is, that is wrong or what you think could be improved. Then I can log it in the system and we can track and talk about each issue seperatly and make sure, we get them all addressed properly instead of listing them off and risking, that we miss something on the way. 

This way you'll be able to say "Hey, Adam, you lazy git! What's going on with issue YLD-xxx?!" and I'll be totally like *It's not my fault guys, really! I have some excuses! But I'll check on it and find out, what's up with that." And you'll be like "Cool bro, no worries, we really appreciate you." And I'll be like "Oh cool, I love you too." But you'll be "We didn't say love..." and then it'll be a bit awkward, but then we'll hug and it'll be all good...but yeah, if you could start a topic for each of these, that would be really helpful ?

[RedEagle_P1. 905]

Kk, I will re-report the core ones: 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 24, 2019 by RedEagle_P1.

[Adam Snellgrove 1451]

Great stuff! ?? I'll jump on it all first thing Monday and we'll see, what's up ? Thanks for the effort. 

[RedEagle_P1. 905]

3 hours ago, Adam Snellgrove said:

Great stuff! ?? I'll jump on it all first thing Monday and we'll see, what's up ? Thanks for the effort. 

Awesome. I really would love if you went after them more than ___ did. I often give steps on how to reproduce the issue -- however it can take 5-10 min a bug to do. I really feel this project will launch to disaster if these gaps are not plugged. If people see you really on-it with bugs I am sure they will be motivated to join in submitting them  

 

Edited August 24, 2019 by RedEagle_P1.

[RedEagle_P1. 905]

17 minutes ago, zarwil said:

0.15 should really just be an all out bug fixing update. No point adding loads of features if game-breaking bugs exist at release.

Yes, someone said it!

Edited August 24, 2019 by RedEagle_P1.

[jchob 354]

Red Seagull started this, any blames go to him, right?

Speaking for myself (and surely I should had firstly say this to some players that I consider my Ylands family):
I joined the game because I suddenly found this forum and I saw a post saying there were an active community on Discord and playing ylands multi-player.
So I joined, why not? ?

I've been around only for like 6 months?

Myself gave up on multi-player, and game itself, and know what? Honestly I'm still here because of some nice players I've met during my journey here. 

So, back to the topic: when I joined, there were a lot of players coming at NA servers, and let's be real, P1 is the most community that puts a lot of effort on this game.

Concerning  P1 NA servers: many of you just don't know HOW MUCH EFFORT bbcakes and MyPa553ng3r put into new maps trying to make them last more time and giving new players a long life on their survival experience.
As mentioned above, servers need a totally new map at maximum of, say? 3 weeks? (or LESS) and in my opinion is that it made players gave up on playing it.
Ylands just doesn't support (yet?) a big multi-player game running for a long time.

First issue, you may ask? Re-generating resources. Iron and clay can be digged all very fast from a player. And another player that comes by will not have any resources to start it's survival journey.

Having to start all over your survival experience every 2 weeks? That's a pain for myself because I'm not a good builder, even though I know I can use blueprints.

As the time passed by, people would join just to see what was new after an update, but yet the same old bugs still kept showing up.
The truth is: many good players i've seen joining the game, had totally left multiplayer experience.

I'm a person that loves the Editor Scripting, but I also must say: this game should be about multiplayer based.
There is no point of improving the Editor and Scripting stuff if we can't get them to a server map that lasts 2 weeks. 

I like programming and game development overall (though i'm just a hobbist person that likes to kill brain cells :D), and I understand the side of BI developers that is hard to put a game working, but I also must look to the player's side.
I totally understand that the game is still under development, but others might not. And the lack of bug-fixings can lead player to feel like they are being ignored.
The players that have been around from start or for a long time, they need to feel that they are listened, that their effort is being helpful for developers.
In my opinion that is what can get us together of seperate. A good communication between community and Ylands Staff is crucial.

I feel like the multiplayer is beeing put aside, though I love the Editor scripting  
Show us what you're planning. Even things that might not happen, but show us  Show us the new buttons for UI panels, for example
Because, we need to see it and how it will change the current version. Many player put a lot of love in here, but updates have been killing their work.

Any blames go to Red, aka The mighty Seagull

And Adam, keep it up, run with community. You might don't realize, but you just woke up us all

Sorry if I am wrong or if I sounded rude.

(maybe I will regret of saying this, but oh well)
See ya around

Edited August 25, 2019 by jchob

[RedEagle_P1. 905]

On 8/25/2019 at 2:26 AM, jchob said:

Red Seagull started this, any blames go to him, right?

Speaking for myself (and surely I should had firstly say this to some players that I consider my Ylands family):
I joined the game because I suddenly found this forum and I saw a post saying there were an active community on Discord and playing ylands multi-player.
So I joined, why not? ?

I've been around only for like 6 months?

Myself gave up on multi-player, and game itself, and know what? Honestly I'm still here because of some nice players I've met during my journey here. 

So, back to the topic: when I joined, there were a lot of players coming at NA servers, and let's be real, P1 is the most community that puts a lot of effort on this game.

Concerning  P1 NA servers: many of you just don't know HOW MUCH EFFORT bbcakes and MyPa553ng3r put into new maps trying to make them last more time and giving new players a long life on their survival experience.
As mentioned above, servers need a totally new map at maximum of, say? 3 weeks? (or LESS) and in my opinion is that it made players gave up on playing it.
Ylands just doesn't support (yet?) a big multi-player game running for a long time.

First issue, you may ask? Re-generating resources. Iron and clay can be digged all very fast from a player. And another player that comes by will not have any resources to start it's survival journey.

Having to start all over your survival experience every 2 weeks? That's a pain for myself because I'm not a good builder, even though I know I can use blueprints.

As the time passed by, people would join just to see what was new after an update, but yet the same old bugs still kept showing up.
The truth is: many good players i've seen joining the game, had totally left multiplayer experience.

I'm a person that loves the Editor Scripting, but I also must say: this game should be about multiplayer based.
There is no point of improving the Editor and Scripting stuff if we can't get them to a server map that lasts 2 weeks. 

I like programming and game development overall (though i'm just a hobbist person that likes to kill brain cells :D), and I understand the side of BI developers that is hard to put a game working, but I also must look to the player's side.
I totally understand that the game is still under development, but others might not. And the lack of bug-fixings can lead player to feel like they are being ignored.
The players that have been around from start or for a long time, they need to feel that they are listened, that their effort is being helpful for developers.
In my opinion that is what can get us together of seperate. A good communication between community and Ylands Staff is crucial.

I feel like the multiplayer is beeing put aside, though I love the Editor scripting  
Show us what you're planning. Even things that might not happen, but show us  Show us the new buttons for UI panels, for example
Because, we need to see it and how it will change the current version. Many player put a lot of love in here, but updates have been killing their work.

Any blames go to Red, aka The mighty Seagull

And Adam, keep it up, run with community. You might don't realize, but you just woke up us all

Sorry if I am wrong or if I sounded rude.

(maybe I will regret of saying this, but oh well)
See ya around

First of all, your post did not sound rude at all (other than calling me a seagull >.>). I felt super bad about my post because I'm just a positive person and I've tried game development and I know it's really really hard and for me devs who can do this might as well be working miracles as i got no idea how they make “working games.” 

I also don't like the general toxicity and entitlement attitude too common in gaming communities. 

That said, I already feel glad about what I said because it helped us get to the core of the matter -- how feedback/bugs are delivered. 

I've come to understand that Bohemia interactive is depending on this community to point out the bugs they need to fix very clearly in posts. However, when the game lost the majority of its player base people have not been playing online and people are not submitting these bugs. 

I think one of the key reasons here is that BI is expecting players to dig deep and find clearly reproducible, specific bugs, where as players are often not technical and say things like "multiplayer is broken". 

In my opinion, more initiative needs to be taken to work with the player base and use their clues to find the issues rather than waiting on the community to identify specific problems. 

I suggest they send their QA testers on servers and make sure they are playing on 8/8 servers for more than a week. 

Moreover, they could pay/reward players to help with QA. 

I agree with the other commenters that right now, what we need more than anything, is for the bugs and the issues to be resolved. I believe this will be the life and death of this game. 

What will excite this community more than any update is to have other people to play with and to have that happen we need the servers to work well (16 player cap too ). 

 

Edited August 26, 2019 by RedEagle_P1.

[Cthulunatic 46]

And we didn't got our JAM prize either. I had to stop working with Ylands because i couldn't justify my 300+ hours work with the JAM to my wife.

[jchob 354]

That is why I said "I understand the BI side" and I know that game development is hard.

I was not attacking devs, I was just trying to make them see that a multiplayer map can work for just 2-3 friends. But for a server map like NA and EUgene it dies pretty fast. And in my opinion that is what needs to be fixed in order to make game more playable, unless their focus is editor + scripting. 

But I'll keep quiet from now on, as I don't want to sound rude or misunderstood. 

[Adam Snellgrove 1451]

6 hours ago, jchob said:

That is why I said "I understand the BI side" and I know that game development is hard.

I was not attacking devs, I was just trying to make them see that a multiplayer map can work for just 2-3 friends. But for a server map like NA and EUgene it dies pretty fast. And in my opinion that is what needs to be fixed in order to make game more playable, unless their focus is editor + scripting. 

But I'll keep quiet from now on, as I don't want to sound rude or misunderstood. 

Don't feel, like you can't give feedback. Feedback is incredibly important to us and crucial for Ylands to prosper and e the best there is ? So thank you fo your comments and we will take them to heart.

[RedEagle_P1. 905]

13 hours ago, jchob said:

That is why I said "I understand the BI side" and I know that game development is hard.

I was not attacking devs, I was just trying to make them see that a multiplayer map can work for just 2-3 friends. But for a server map like NA and EUgene it dies pretty fast. And in my opinion that is what needs to be fixed in order to make game more playable, unless their focus is editor + scripting. 

But I'll keep quiet from now on, as I don't want to sound rude or misunderstood. 

I am so sorry, I meant to say DID NOT sound rude at all!! I dont know what happened there! I am so sorry!

[Deadeye_Rob 908]

I'll be short & sweet with my 50 pence contribution to this ?.

 

I think RedEagle hit the nail on the head with regard to the lack of player creations.

I love the Editor, it's a great tool where I've spent hours testing my creativity and a unique element of Ylands as a product.

 

That said, Explore Mode is where all the social fun is to be had and I really welcome the Devs intentions to expand it. I often create my projects on Editor in order to use them on an Explore server as a blueprint!

 

Ive always said that Ylands has the potential to be the natural successor to Minecraft. To that end, I believe we need a bug/glitch-free Explore mode with more content, blocks, (maybe even energy driven crafting stations).

Its Your Islands, let's just take it!

[kimbuck 746]

From what i hear  about the changes to explore, ( smaller maps etc ) the further away from the initial  concept of the game, ylands is headed. I am no one of the  battle and  "shoot  em up" types... I. prefer creative  co operation with others

Sadly, whats  proposed  is no longer what i really  expected from the trailer and initial concept. But that's  just  me

I guess i will spend less time in game and possibly  join the other score of  friends  who i no longer see in game.

A shame,   ... but to those friends i have in the game  i will still be around, just not so active.  Unless something happens  to  make the game playable, interesting, and less like a  gameboy/donkey kong / derivative.

[bojo2736 1016]

@kimbuck Adam clarified at the party today, the islands won't be smaller. They will be fewer in number, but more things to do. 

I see good reasons why that might be true. Why have three identical arid islands? And more than one polar is a waste of opportunity.

[Miguel Preguisa 443]

8 hours ago, bojo2736 said:

@kimbuck Adam clarified at the party today, the islands won't be smaller. They will be fewer in number, but more things to do. 

I see good reasons why that might be true. Why have three identical arid islands? And more than one polar is a waste of opportunity

He should really state this somewhere. I've been listening to the P1 livestream party too and what he said there was quite different from what anybody who read his dev diary would get from it. 

[RedEagle_P1. 905]

On 8/25/2019 at 1:26 AM, jchob said:

Red Seagull started this, any blames go to him, right?

Speaking for myself (and surely I should had firstly say this to some players that I consider my Ylands family):
I joined the game because I suddenly found this forum and I saw a post saying there were an active community on Discord and playing ylands multi-player.
So I joined, why not? ?

I've been around only for like 6 months?

Myself gave up on multi-player, and game itself, and know what? Honestly I'm still here because of some nice players I've met during my journey here. 

So, back to the topic: when I joined, there were a lot of players coming at NA servers, and let's be real, P1 is the most community that puts a lot of effort on this game.

Concerning  P1 NA servers: many of you just don't know HOW MUCH EFFORT bbcakes and MyPa553ng3r put into new maps trying to make them last more time and giving new players a long life on their survival experience.
As mentioned above, servers need a totally new map at maximum of, say? 3 weeks? (or LESS) and in my opinion is that it made players gave up on playing it.
Ylands just doesn't support (yet?) a big multi-player game running for a long time.

First issue, you may ask? Re-generating resources. Iron and clay can be digged all very fast from a player. And another player that comes by will not have any resources to start it's survival journey.

Having to start all over your survival experience every 2 weeks? That's a pain for myself because I'm not a good builder, even though I know I can use blueprints.

As the time passed by, people would join just to see what was new after an update, but yet the same old bugs still kept showing up.
The truth is: many good players i've seen joining the game, had totally left multiplayer experience.

I'm a person that loves the Editor Scripting, but I also must say: this game should be about multiplayer based.
There is no point of improving the Editor and Scripting stuff if we can't get them to a server map that lasts 2 weeks. 

I like programming and game development overall (though i'm just a hobbist person that likes to kill brain cells :D), and I understand the side of BI developers that is hard to put a game working, but I also must look to the player's side.
I totally understand that the game is still under development, but others might not. And the lack of bug-fixings can lead player to feel like they are being ignored.
The players that have been around from start or for a long time, they need to feel that they are listened, that their effort is being helpful for developers.
In my opinion that is what can get us together of seperate. A good communication between community and Ylands Staff is crucial.

I feel like the multiplayer is beeing put aside, though I love the Editor scripting  
Show us what you're planning. Even things that might not happen, but show us  Show us the new buttons for UI panels, for example
Because, we need to see it and how it will change the current version. Many player put a lot of love in here, but updates have been killing their work.

Any blames go to Red, aka The mighty Seagull

And Adam, keep it up, run with community. You might don't realize, but you just woke up us all

Sorry if I am wrong or if I sounded rude.

(maybe I will regret of saying this, but oh well)
See ya around

 

On 12/4/2020 at 8:25 PM, jchob said:

I just want to say we have to live with the choices team is making, either we like it or not.

No point browsing tons of topics and read the same from different players...

They went for editor first and then mobile. That's it. We need to get over it.

People stopped to help with ideas and suggestions and started to only complain. And dont tell me again "they dont listen", because thats not true.

Im so disappointed with the community. Im sorry to say that, but its how I feel.

Meanwhile many things were fixed in exploration and other kept unfixed. That also happened to editor.

Its just my personal taste, but i dont even know how MC got so popular. It looked cool when it was launched, but with all those new survival games, MC would be my last option. And its not comparable to ylands, imo. 

I like how ylands was some updates ago, but im really loving how its coming along.

All your posts complaining is taking the amusment out of me. I dont wven have will to open ylands.

This being said, there are people who dont like the path ylands is taking, but there are people who likes it. So, consider you are making those people sad when they only see complains about the game they love.

I am sad to see you gave up on explore. We don't mean to make you sad but just to hope to help BI make this dream a success.